I think vulnerability is precisely why Pryor has aged better than Carlin.
Rock went this direction with Tambourine (2018), which was impressive, but then regressed in his latest special.
My favorite hour of Chappelle’s is The Bird Revelation for this same reason.
Also worth noting, in Sincerely (2020), Louis CK does address the cancelation, and I think he nails it. One of his best specials for that reason alone, although I think Hilarious and Chewed Up are still his best. I think he does address his sexual urges in basically every special, especially in Live at the Beacon and Word at Carnegie.
Pryor was really the first comic to make this kind of vulnerability desirable; Louis made it mainstream, and then Mike Birbiglia piggybacked on that and opened up a completely new genre that comics like Hasan Minhaj and Jerrod Carmichael have made their names in
My recollection is that Louis mentioned it offhandedly but not directly in Sincerely, but I could be misremembering. But yeah him talking about jerking off a lot can certainly be viewed as it's own kind of explanation. I loved At The Dolby and thought it was his best in many years.
Chappelle's "DAVID I'M THIRSTY!" line from Bird Revelation is so damn hilarious. My wife and I still quote it to each other to this day.
It's also been interesting to hear him riff on the industry dynamics. I think he tiptoes a little, so that he doesn't burn bridges, but he's really articulate and incisive when he starts riffing about the business side of comedy.
I forget where he talked about it, but there was a particularly good rant about realizing that, had he sold his first couple CD specials independently, by hand, directly to night-club crowds at the end of his set each night, he would have made more money than he did from the record labels.
It's an eye opening moment when you realize the people at the top are there not just because they're the funniest, but because they understand the business side of comedy as well. Lethal combo.
This is a really poignant piece about art in general. There was this indie rock album that came out years and years ago - "The Ugly Organ" by Cursive. I was writing for one of those small, free papers that advertise concerts, ladies nights, etc. My gig was to interview rock, punk, and metal musicians in advance of their concerts. I remember a number of conversations with musicians about "the Ugly Organ" - this album really connected with them. One overarching theme of the album was that your fans want your pain, your mistakes, all your worst because they want to achieve catharsis through your music. But if you ever achieve that same catharsis through your own music, you'll be without an audience, so you're incentivized to be miserable.
This is a really interesting piece and I'm glad to see a platform for examining stand-up as an art form.
You touched on something toward the end that I'd be interested to see you explore at greater length: the fact that modern comedians seem to have the most hostile comment sections of any sort of public figure. And a lot of that hostility seems to come from people who've been following this person as a loyal fan for a decade+. You're showing how Burr's mature enough to handle that, but you mention Burt Kreischer: he seems genuinely haunted by the stuff people say about him online. A lot of them do.
But yeah: this was a delight to read, I'm really glad to see someone study the arc of a comedian's career and spell out the growth!
I wonder how much of this is related to the medium, as well? I definitely don't claim to keep my pulse on the stand-up community, but the little I’ve heard from the outside really paints a volatile picture; I wonder how much of a market there is for comics to really explore more of the “male condition” and whether more comics would explore this or change if they weren’t concerned about losing their audience?
I think it’s primarily a function of the degree of difficulty. It’s difficult enough to write a compelling essay or novel or movie script about the male condition, but it’s even more difficult to do a live performance about it while also generating laughs every 15-20 seconds. So a lot of guys just stick to the “sad clown fall down” routine.
Only a select few are skilled enough to pull it off.
I switch back and forth between thinking Louis and Bill are the best, depending on who I've seen most recently. Something about redheads, I guess. I sort of have always understood that most comedy greats have a very dark and sad heart, I thought that was sort of standard. No one can be as cruel as a truly optimistic and happy person, and no one as empathetic and understanding of the great comic tragedy of life than a true comedian, who generally have very bleak persoecrives that most couldn't tolerate. They're the best people.
Killed it with this one, Peter. The history of standup comedy has always been fascinating for me. Showtime aired a doc on The Comedy Store a few years back, Mike Binder may have directed or produced it? If it was 5 hours I could’ve watched it for 20.
Thanks! My favorite Comedy Store story is how Mitzi hated Seinfeld and never really booked him in the 80s, and then in the 90s he’d see her out for walks as he drove to the NBC lot in the morning to tape Seinfeld. They’d nod at each other and Jerry knew that he had won.
Thank you. I don't know Burr, bur I know his anger and the struggle making sense of it and trying to learn how to transmute that energy, rather than suppressing it or exploding with it. It helps to read about his journey. And I will explore his work!
This is a great essay. I’m a comic in New York.
I think vulnerability is precisely why Pryor has aged better than Carlin.
Rock went this direction with Tambourine (2018), which was impressive, but then regressed in his latest special.
My favorite hour of Chappelle’s is The Bird Revelation for this same reason.
Also worth noting, in Sincerely (2020), Louis CK does address the cancelation, and I think he nails it. One of his best specials for that reason alone, although I think Hilarious and Chewed Up are still his best. I think he does address his sexual urges in basically every special, especially in Live at the Beacon and Word at Carnegie.
Pryor was really the first comic to make this kind of vulnerability desirable; Louis made it mainstream, and then Mike Birbiglia piggybacked on that and opened up a completely new genre that comics like Hasan Minhaj and Jerrod Carmichael have made their names in
My recollection is that Louis mentioned it offhandedly but not directly in Sincerely, but I could be misremembering. But yeah him talking about jerking off a lot can certainly be viewed as it's own kind of explanation. I loved At The Dolby and thought it was his best in many years.
Chappelle's "DAVID I'M THIRSTY!" line from Bird Revelation is so damn hilarious. My wife and I still quote it to each other to this day.
Proposition: Bill Burr has released more comedy albums worth listening to than any other comedian who ever lived. Discuss.
His level of quality and quantity is unmatched.
It's also been interesting to hear him riff on the industry dynamics. I think he tiptoes a little, so that he doesn't burn bridges, but he's really articulate and incisive when he starts riffing about the business side of comedy.
I forget where he talked about it, but there was a particularly good rant about realizing that, had he sold his first couple CD specials independently, by hand, directly to night-club crowds at the end of his set each night, he would have made more money than he did from the record labels.
It's an eye opening moment when you realize the people at the top are there not just because they're the funniest, but because they understand the business side of comedy as well. Lethal combo.
This is a really poignant piece about art in general. There was this indie rock album that came out years and years ago - "The Ugly Organ" by Cursive. I was writing for one of those small, free papers that advertise concerts, ladies nights, etc. My gig was to interview rock, punk, and metal musicians in advance of their concerts. I remember a number of conversations with musicians about "the Ugly Organ" - this album really connected with them. One overarching theme of the album was that your fans want your pain, your mistakes, all your worst because they want to achieve catharsis through your music. But if you ever achieve that same catharsis through your own music, you'll be without an audience, so you're incentivized to be miserable.
Agreed. It should be the opposite. It should inspire them to join you.
Fun piece. Used to love Burr. Been a while. Men getting honest and vulnerable about emotions is a damn good thing. We need more of it.
Outstanding piece.
This is a really interesting piece and I'm glad to see a platform for examining stand-up as an art form.
You touched on something toward the end that I'd be interested to see you explore at greater length: the fact that modern comedians seem to have the most hostile comment sections of any sort of public figure. And a lot of that hostility seems to come from people who've been following this person as a loyal fan for a decade+. You're showing how Burr's mature enough to handle that, but you mention Burt Kreischer: he seems genuinely haunted by the stuff people say about him online. A lot of them do.
But yeah: this was a delight to read, I'm really glad to see someone study the arc of a comedian's career and spell out the growth!
I wonder how much of this is related to the medium, as well? I definitely don't claim to keep my pulse on the stand-up community, but the little I’ve heard from the outside really paints a volatile picture; I wonder how much of a market there is for comics to really explore more of the “male condition” and whether more comics would explore this or change if they weren’t concerned about losing their audience?
I think it’s primarily a function of the degree of difficulty. It’s difficult enough to write a compelling essay or novel or movie script about the male condition, but it’s even more difficult to do a live performance about it while also generating laughs every 15-20 seconds. So a lot of guys just stick to the “sad clown fall down” routine.
Only a select few are skilled enough to pull it off.
I switch back and forth between thinking Louis and Bill are the best, depending on who I've seen most recently. Something about redheads, I guess. I sort of have always understood that most comedy greats have a very dark and sad heart, I thought that was sort of standard. No one can be as cruel as a truly optimistic and happy person, and no one as empathetic and understanding of the great comic tragedy of life than a true comedian, who generally have very bleak persoecrives that most couldn't tolerate. They're the best people.
The comedy they create is a great counterbalance to the dark worldview.
Love your writing, peter
Thank you!
Killed it with this one, Peter. The history of standup comedy has always been fascinating for me. Showtime aired a doc on The Comedy Store a few years back, Mike Binder may have directed or produced it? If it was 5 hours I could’ve watched it for 20.
Thanks! My favorite Comedy Store story is how Mitzi hated Seinfeld and never really booked him in the 80s, and then in the 90s he’d see her out for walks as he drove to the NBC lot in the morning to tape Seinfeld. They’d nod at each other and Jerry knew that he had won.
He must’ve loved that every single day.
Thank you. I don't know Burr, bur I know his anger and the struggle making sense of it and trying to learn how to transmute that energy, rather than suppressing it or exploding with it. It helps to read about his journey. And I will explore his work!
Let It Go is probably a good place to start. It’s not on a streamer anymore, but you can find the whole thing on YouTube.
Really fantastic. Thanks
I don't find him particularly funny, but I like listening to him anyway.